I need your help / ideas / advice (My next big step)

Hey everyone,

I’m Khaled from Coriander Games, the one behind the recently released Miko Adventures Puffball.
Steam: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1614960/Miko_Adventures_Puffball
Itch: https://coriandergames.itch.io/miko-adventures-puffball
Voxpop Games: https://www.voxpopgames.site/store/573

Just a small note: I’d like everyone to participate in this conversation, I need to hear all ideas and all sides even if it’s your first time entering GDevelop, if you play games then your opinion will matter to me.

Now I’d like to talk to you about something and I want your help / ideas / advice about my next step…

Now based on my current situation, Miko Adventures Puffball unfortunately didn’t do very well when it got released, that doesn’t mean it’s gone or it’s bad, it just means that the game is not a great fit for the current market, most games now are dark, making a “cute” approach was a big mistake, I’m still working on marketing and good news will come with time, the thing I know is that I won’t stop doing marketing for Miko until I reach something decent with it no matter how long that will take…

If we’re talking about feedback from players (whether they bought it or got a free copy) it was 99% positive which is a very good to me, people who played are having a fun time and that’s what matters the most, I just need to keep showing it to more and more people all the time.

Now away from Miko…

Everyone, I have the concept of my next project, it’s something new, ambitious and big…
I’m talking of a quality close to games like Hollow Knight… like I said before I will be going big this time… I can’t say the name of my next game now, can’t talk about any concepts, can’t share any info about it at the moment but it’s something that will take from 2 to 3 years and maybe more if we go crazy with it… It’s a concept probably never seen before in the industry, what I can say is that it’s dark and will take a lot more serious approach with a tough world to navigate through.

Now…

I’d like you to put yourself in my situation, you made a game that didn’t have the success you wished for, so you decide to go for another project, first time you went with the “cute” approach and it didn’t work out, now I’m going for the opposite approach which is the “tough serious” approach.
Now let’s talk in development, what do you do? do you go with the same route and thinking? or do you take a different approach to it?

A different approach is like instead of making a game for 2-4 years all alone with no idea if this will work or not, you create a prototype in like 4-6 months and then send it to publishers around the world just to see how they will approach this idea and based on their feedback I go from here.

They didn’t like it? then it’s time to cancel this idea and think of another.
They like it? then it’s time to improve it and finish it till the end.

But then again do I really care for what publishers say about my next game that much? maybe because they are in the industry for a long time and know what works and what doesn’t, but I’ve seen other games where they were rejected by many publishers and then were a huge success when it got released so yeah I’m not really sure about this idea but it’s on my mind…

So yeah…

I’d like to hear your ideas for how to approach this next project?
I was also thinking about Kickstarter but it’s too much work and require a lot of time to get it ready with no guarantee that it will work but anyway that’s an idea on my mind.

I need to hear your ideas…
I need to hear what would you do if you were me…

I just don’t want to fail this time as I’ll be creating something truly unique and something that will take a lot of time, I don’t want to be haunted for years with me thinking that the end road is just failing.
Many of you probably know me by now and you know that for me making games is not a joke, I don’t just create but I perfect what I create to release games with the highest possible quality, it’s even in the bio of Coriander Games.

Also the goal here is not Money, the goal is building a community around the game and from there money will come, but the most important thing for me is more players.

Anyway I’ll be right here reading your comments on what the best approach is…

Thank you

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Also I just got a new cool idea, maybe instead of making a prototype and send it to publishers, I make an amazing demo of about 20 - 30 mins, send it to content creators and let them make videos about it, this way I get people talk about the game long time before it’s released and this way a lot of people will know that the game exist at least.

And before sending it, I make sure that the steam page is live so people can Wishlist it on steam and so on and start building this player community way before the game is out…

And the demo won’t be public, it will be just for certain content creators, this way I get people hyped even more about it.

Let me know what you think about this one, I think this idea is epic…

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You have to think of your brand identity. At the moment it’s Miko, which is cute and cuddly. If you then go dark, it’ll create confusion to what you are and represent. You’ll get a hodge podge of an audience who aren’t as loyal because the game you made ,in the genre/style they like, appears like a one off.

So I’d still look at cute, but a different platform. Instead of PC based, I’d look at the mobile & tablet market. I believe that’s where a lot more cute and fluffy type games are being appreciated, particularly as this tends to be by younger players, who aren’t into keyboard controls as much, and more into intuitive inputs like touch and tilt.

This would mean thinking away from the usual in terms of controls - using touch, device tilt, vocal (microphone) or visual(camera) inputs. On screen controls for input may look ok, but my personal views is that they’re naff, take up precious real estate, and are useless and a bad move for a few reasons (I won’t bore you with at this point).

However, if you do go more serious (as I suspect you’re already set on this), consider a different brand or company name. I mean, if you think Rockstar Games, you think GTA, you think gore and violence. Not unicorns and rainbows and happiness. The same should apply to Corriander Games.

That’s my 2 cents worth.

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Check out this 30 minute video on Steam page makeovers for maximum impact

The idea of sending out a demo to content creators is a great idea. Just make sure you go for the ones who resonate with, and are followed by, your target audience.

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My background is film. I graduated from Art Center in Pasadena, California and was taught by some industry pros, so I’ll pass to you what they taught me.

  1. Make something that is close to your heart. Something that you know really well because that’s what will come to you easier and you can explain it on a deeper level.

    For example, since I was 6, I had a fascination for
    fairytales, fantasy stories like LOTR and being
    raised Catholic with my mom invoking fear about
    the devil, I became fascinated with vampires and
    demons.

    So when I wrote about any of these topics as a
    screenplay, it came fast to me and was easy and
    fun. At the same time, I added layers and layers
    to the story.

  • For you, if innocence and using the style you did with
    Miko is closest to your heart, then stick to it. Failure is success in disguise. Thomas Edison failed a thousand times to finally invent the light bulb.

Many games I’ve played eventually get boring because they become repetitive. Look at Clash of Clans. It was a big hit, but after playing it for 1-2 weeks, it got boring real quick.

No offense. Miko would be comparable to Super Mario Bros when it first came out and after a while, it kind of becomes repetitive.

Users in general are like movie watchers, they like to see something new each minute that makes them crave to see more and to know what’s going to happen next.

When a user or movie watcher, let’s call them the “consumer” can predict what will happen next, they naturally lose interest and walk away.

So even if you changed the artwork of Miko to say a hunter hunting vampires. Yes, it will be fun and after repetition kicks in, will become boring.

So why did Super Mario Bros succeed?

Well, it had a storyline. Mario needed to save the princess and each level had its challenges along with different bosses for each stage.

You shouldn’t be so hard on yourself. Just look at what parts of Miko did that worked and don’t repeat what didn’t work. Maybe try adding bosses to each level where each boss does it’s own pattern of movement and attack?

Then add a storyline that has a beginning, middle and and end.

Then release this as an updated version? The point is to see how long users engage into your game and to see if you end up getting more new users.

Also, I don’t see Miko Adventures Puffball in the Apple App store. Is this for Android only? Steam?

Apple, Android, Steam are different type of users with a different market.

If Miko isn’t on Google Play then maybe your game isn’t a failure. It’s because no one knows about it because it’s not on Google Play or the Apple app store.

Also, right now might be a good time to make some friends with people who have kids to let the kids test your games.

Disney is infamous for this. They send out sentinels to schools to ask the kids on what characters they like. They then report their findings to see what most kids like at that time. So for example, most kids like a snowman, well the let there be Frozen.

The old saying in film school is, if you can entertain a kid, then you have no issue entertainment an adult.

For your games, if you see the kids playing Miko nonstop like they’re addicted to drugs, then you just hit the jackpot.

If the kid plays something else after playing Miko for say 3 minutes, then look at what part of the game the kids stopped playing at and then play from the beginning of that game to where the kids stopped playing to try to understand why they stopped playing.

Else, you can make a hundred games that look different, play different , but will yield the same results.

Look at Clash of Clans. I downloaded so many variations of that game to where I felt like someone was selling the COC game engine online and just changing the artwork that I got bored of all of them and stopped playing because they were all the same.

I even stopped playing the 3rd person RPG games because they all played the same. You run around killing enemies that you never even met, level up, and run around again. See the repetition?

Do you know the definition of insanity?

It’s doing the same thing over and over and over.

So it’s actually a good thing to know that most consumers are not insane because they got bored.

Adapt and overcome. You will fail your way to success.

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I have no experience with released projects, it’s just thoughts.

  1. Miko project
    I believe that you simply did not find your target audience. As written above, for the development of the project, port them to other platforms. Steam has a more hardcore audience than mobile, which enjoys darker games. Look for Twitch content creators, YouTube that specialize in these kinds of games.

  2. 2-4 years is a very long time for a project. The sooner you show it to the players, the more time you will need to maintain the audience’s interest in the project (developer diary, demonstration of new content, etc.). As you noticed, now “dark” games are popular, but it is not known what will be popular in 1-2 years. Therefore, it is dangerous to be guided by current trends in the long term. As mentioned above, suggest your style, your story, which will be interesting.

If you do two projects at the same time and show it to the players, they may misunderstand. I would suggest doing a second project without showing it, create dev diaries, but publish it later to evenly distribute the material throughout the game and at the same time maintain interest through the constant publication of “new” content.

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Wondering what makes you think that it is the cute theme that people were not interested in? Obviously if you want to target psychopaths I can see how it was a mistake not to add a chainsaw in to the hands of Miko to slay baby bears in the forest.

Wondering who is your target with Miko and what was your expectations because you talk like you were expecting Miko to make a huge explosion that even Ubisoft going to pay attention to…

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@MrMen

The brand identity thing is definetly correct…
The issue is this

Miko was not supposed to feel like that, but it looked like that.
The issue was the design and art style didn’t give players what I was actually going for but that’s not something to think about right now, what happened has happened and I didn’t get bad thoughts about the game and people are having fun with it so it’s cool.

The story behind Miko is actually dark but the story didn’t show it that much or maybe the story telling of the game didn’t work too well with what I was going for.

A brand identity is hard to think about when you just released 1 game, if I had 10 cute games then I decide to go dark then yeah something is off… But I’m just starting so I think the brand identity is not yet created for Coriander Games to begin with, you can say that I’m “testing the waters” as they say.

Miko is a start of many more serious projects, it’s the building block of what is coming, it’s a showcase of what quality I’m aiming for.

Yeah I’m currently building the list for this for sure, not yet sure if this is what I’ll be going for but it’s defiantly an idea to think about and consider, it will make the game more visible way before it gets out and that will make it build a community around it.

I want to thank you for such a great point though, a brand identity is something important to think about when I’m creating my next project for sure, thank you for joining the conversation.

@RbetterKids

Thanks a lot for joining in and sharing your experience even though it’s from a film making background.

100% with on this and what I’m going to be creating next is definitely something that I love so much and have so much passion for, it’ll be like the true identity of Coriander Games and what I was actually have in mind in the first place when I entered game development.

Totally respect that, I get that very well.

Alright let me explain, the cute approach was never my goal, I just got stuck with it as I worked so hard on it and so I decided to make it to the end, I’m not about leaving projects mid way you know…
This is visible in Miko but only when you play and venture deep into levels, the game is challenging and require planning for every move and so on, that’s what I was going for in the first place.
But the art style didn’t show that quite well.
The game is inspired by Dark souls world design and Hollow Knight so from that alone you get an idea of what my main goal is here, I even got 2 comments, 1 from a streamer and another from a player and they both said the same thing that I want people to see in Miko.
They said, “It’s dark souls, the cute version” … that’s it! that’s what I was aiming for.
The game is not designed for “Kids” Miko is a difficult game, no kid will handle the difficulty of this game, it was aimed for grown people from the age of let’s say (16 - 45)
It’s build around the concepts of dying and learning from your mistakes just like in Dark Souls and Hollow Kinght.

I respect you opinion 100% but let me explain a bit more on this:
(Repetitive) is such a common word in games, I mean if you look around, 95% of games are repetitive and that’s normal.
You see games have to have a wall around it to contain it, this wall is called a gameplay loop, in Miko the gameplay loop is collecting, exploring and so on…
Look at games like Assassin’s creed, it gets so repetitive so fast because well … the gameplay loop, kill that, go here, travel here, do that and repeat…
Look at Farcry and again it gets boring so quick because of the same reasons.
Look at watch dogs, look at almost any game …
You’ll find the repetitive feel there … all games are repetitive and it’s a normal thing, the important thing is that it’s repetitive in a good way not a bad way.

Very true but in games that’s very hard to do, I tried doing that with Miko by changing the feel of every level and I’m not going to lie it worked, it’s what makes players go to the end because they want to see what the next world will look like, I’m impressed by how many people reached the end of the game and if not for the diverse background, players wouldn’t be reaching the end because the gameplay loop in Miko is a bit limited but again it’s my first game so yeah, I did what I can.

Can’t argue with that at all, it’s the norm in every game ever existed.

Thank you for saying this “You shouldn’t be so hard on yourself” and yeah I shouldn’t, I did something great, I just need to learn from my mistakes that’s all, that’s how we evolve anyway, and I’m currently doing that and writing down what needs to be changed and what needs to be improved and so on…

No I don’t think I’ll be updating Miko any further, I want to keep moving forward, I want to create something new and move on and learn from my mistakes.

It’s a PC game, Coriander Games is a PC company at the moment, Android and other mobile stores are not my goal at the moment, maybe in the future though, making Miko a mobile game will require a ton of optimization, not worth the risk at the moment, but maybe in the future.

Clash of Clans is so boring, I couldn’t even handle like 2 hours of this game :joy:

Exactly love that you mentioned that, that’s why I’m aiming for something completely different in my next game, no leveling up and that crap, I want the player to feel vulnerable all the time, you’re not the “Hero” … you’re part of the world and what you do affect that world and so on…

That’s a quote I love of Vas from Farcry 3 :smile:

Respect to that!

Thank you so much for your detailed reply : )

If you are going for a hard platformer again, I’d suggest a few changes.

  1. I would balance out the frustration aspect a bit more. I understand that the player frustration in Miko is by design but I think it is the wrong kind of frustration. Miko to me is more like a rage game than a challenging game like for example Hollow Knight (taking it as an example as you seem to be very inspired by it). What I mean by that is that while Hollow Knight makes the player frustrated by his lack of skill and is thereby encouraged to train himself to beat the game, Miko makes the player frustrated at the game, making them want to ragequit it. Putting a spike right at the entrance of a hidden secret area, giving the fireball a very small hitbox (and it being the only weapon regardless of the enemy), all the things like this cause this kind of frustration. Hollow Knight for example balances that out by having different weapons and abilities more suited to kill certain kinds of enemies and when you fail at using them, it never seems that it was because of the game design but because you as the player made a mistake. It also does not only punishes the player when they do something bad (lives system) but also rewards them for making something good (Soul system). Stuff like this stabilizes the frustration to be encouraging, not to be discouraging.

  2. Miko is a bit too much “always the same”. You are given one base weapon and basic platforming abilities and that’s it. Sure, there are new types of enemies and obstacles but the platforming and combat system does not really evolve much, and as a player, one can feel that. I would suggest to, like Hollow Knight, add new unlockable platforming and combat abilities that will allow you to create more interesting enemies and platforming challenges, reward the player in a way that motivates them to continue playing, and gives new ways of interacting with the world and discovering new ways to use the new abilities to pass new obstacles or revisit old places with previously insurmountable obstacles, making the game more fun.

  3. I think you could use some better world-building. Miko does not feel like he has a world he truly is in, since he constantly jumps to other worlds through the portals. Apart from the enemies, nothing is really coherent; It keeps on changing, making it hard to get engaged with that world. Even minimal platforming games like Mario have much world-building (The plumber Mario wants to save the princess Peach from the evil Koopa king Bowser who kidnapped her. For that, he will have to go through all 8 zones of the Mushroom kingdom between him and Bowser’s castle. But Bowser expected that, and sent his minion to stop Mario on his way!) compared to Miko (Miko is a raccoon. He touched a portal and now he is stuck in another world. He goes on to touch portals and getting stuck in other worlds.). I think a more clearly defined and consistent world would allow players to “bind” with the game, making them want to continue playing. Some kind of story or real goal that you have to play more to discover the rest from would give players more incentive to continue playing, kind of like a carrot on a stick, just like Mario games do with the kidnapped princess that you try to rescue or how in Hollow Knight you want to discover what happened there exactly and continue to play to discover more about the world you are in, its past, its inhabitants, etc.

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@E1e5en

Thank you for joining even though you didn’t release a game, it means a lot you’re helping no worries, everyone is welcome in this conversation : )

Yes I’m 100% with you on this, I got many fans of the game at the moment, I just need to keep on looking for more and it’s what I’m doing at the moment, I haven’t found someone who played the game that didn’t like it, got bored or anything, most reached the end expect for the people who play for a one time thing and so on like reviewers and so on but even many of them did play it to the end.
Also I got around 10 streamers who played the game and more will come, also good news will come soon and so on… the more I show it to people the more they get interested so yeah you’re 100% correct in that.

That’s respect right there, you’re so correct with that and that’s why I said that I’ll createa special demo only for content creators and from there I start getting wishlists and so on and build that community for over 2 years or more depending on the development time, I don’t want to stay in my room for 2-4 years alone again and do the same mistake again, I want to go out this time as soon as possible.
Also the “Dark” theme will stay, I don’t think it’s going away anytime soon

No no not going that route for sure, I’m talking about something that will happen like maybe 2 years from now, the next project is big and there will a lot of learning involved, you’ll see me a lot in the next years here asking and so on :smile:
It’s going to be difficult but I can do it if I keep at it I’m sure of that.

Definitely yeah I understand that for sure and this is what will happen, I’m not done with Miko at all, I’ll be doing marketing for the rest of 2022 so yeah…
There will be sometime before anything comes out again from Coriander Games.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts, very helpful : )

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(That’s actually originally from Albert Einstein)

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I didn’t say that, the market says that : )

That’s not my goal at all no, also targeting the more serious approach doesn’t mean I’m targeting “psychopaths”, I’m talking about players and people, and let me just say that a “serious approach” doesn’t mean blood and gore, let that sink in, I haven’t said a word about what is coming in the future so you can’t make assumptions about something that doesn’t exist yet : )

Grown people 100% … the art style just didn’t reflect that well, but many players are getting the idea once they play and venture deep into the game and that’s what matters the most.

To have a small base to build upon and the good news is, It’s starting to build up … I just need more time and keep working on marketing, good news will be always be coming about Miko, I won’t stop : )

And why not? thinking that your game is not something big or interesting could kill your passion, for sure I haven’t said I’m waiting for Ubisoft to play my game or anything like that, I have no idea why you would even say that.

Just don’t forget that Hollow Knight was made by 2 friends, they worked hard for 2 years and made millions after, if they can do it … anyone can do it.
It’s only a matter of self control and continuing no matter how many fails you get and much work is involved. I don’t think that those 2 friends were waiting for Ubisoft to play their game, they made a game that made Ubisoft look like crap to be honest…

And again, if they can do it… I can do it … you can do it … anyone can do it.
Time will only tell…

Also saying Miko failed doesn’t mean it’s a bad game, it’s only marketing that I’m talking about and this post is about marketing only, I’m working on fixing the marketing issue and things are starting to pick up and good things will keep happening.

I’m not sure why the angry tone btw? I’m just asking for help, advice for my next step
I learn from people experiences and so far this post has been such a great help.

@arthuro555

(That’s actually originally from Albert Einstein)

Yeah you’re correct :sweat_smile:

@arthuro555

For sure, I respect your opinion for sure and what you said has some true to it for sure.

I’d love to talk to you about my next move, but I can’t right now, but yes expect a world like that in my future game, I just can’t talk too much about it :sweat_smile: but I understand every word you are saying for sure and rest assured it’s what I’m aiming for :fire:
Miko was a learning step for me, that’s why it was a bit limited so yeah…

You said that so well and yes it’s on my list, world building and a deep story to get players stuck with the game, totally a great point you got there.

Thank you so much Arthuro, and I promise when the time comes, I’ll be sharing with you more details as I’ll need a lot of help with a lot of stuff in the game, it’s going to be big, and bigger than my capabilities and I’ll need help from everyone to make this one work out, expect something epic in the future!

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I was genuinely believe that you are targeting younger people. It is not just the art style but the actual gameplay is also very minimalistic compared to more serious games.

It is also a bit arrogant to believe that you can compete with 0 budget, 0 experience, as a single developer with teams of 100 people who’s got significantly more budget, more experience and god knows maybe even more talent, better ideas, better designs maybe?

Now, in my opinion this is the point when you lose passion, when you begin to follow the market instead of your heart.

I don’t know the history of the game, it is possible but certainly they did not make the game because this is what the market dictated but because this is what they were passionate about and their success is the result of the high quality work they’ve done.

And again, it is arrogant to believe that just because 2 person did it, anybody can do it. In many cases, small teams don’t mention 3rd parties they hired to get certain programming and art jobs done. You don’t always put those people in to the credits, you hire them and pay them to get something done, end of story, you don’t credit them, you pay them. So I am always sceptic when teams of 1-2 people claim they did it all on their own. It is almost never true. But still a very nice achievement that certainly not everybody can do.

It was not my intention to use angry tone, I am just sorry to see that you consider Miko a failure and forget everything you have achieved with 0 experience, 0 knowledge, 0 budget and to see that you seriously believe that you can compete even with big studios so badly you even refuse to release a free demo of the game.

Just to give you an idea where I am coming from, I can play all these games on Apple Arcade for as low as $5 on mobile and desktop, no ads, no in-app purchase, I can play ALL for $5:

Castlevania Grimoire of souls
Samurai jack
Exit the Gungeon
Fallen Knight
EarthNight
Spidersaurus
Oceanhorn
Little Orpheus
Shinsekai Into the Depths
INMOST
Mutazione
Jumper Jon
Shantae and the Seven Sirens
Neversong
Star Fetched
Projection First Light

…and a lot more

You can find everything in here, deep story, fast paced action, puzzles to solve, adventure, pixel art, vector graphics, serious, playful, dark.
Again I don’t know the history of these games, but I refuse to believe that any of these games were made by 1-3 people from 0 budget with 0 experience and 0 knowledge. And this is what you are up against without a free demo available because you strongly believe every minute of Miko worth money and people should pay to try while you enjoy the benefit of a free and open-source engine.

I don’t know I just dislike this mentality you shown since the release of Miko: Puffball and I feel sorry about the way you see things, let’s just put it that way.

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No worries. So your style is like Tim Burton with regards to Hollow Knight, which is great. Now I am curious myself. :slight_smile:

I am very happy you took my comments so well. I was typing as fast as I could on my phone and forgot to put the “Please don’t get offended” part at the top and bottom of my comments.

However, I can tell you have the right attitude, so your success is only inevitable.

Sorry, didn’t know the insanity quote was from Farcry 3. A coworker said it to me when I was trying to look for a USB mouse at the time. :slight_smile:

The only reason I ask if your next game is on Android or iOS is in the film/tv industry, things have already shifted to mobile devices, as consumers watch them more on their phones because of convenience.

In the gaming industry, ever since games like Eternium came out on Android/iOS, this is when mobile devices proved to be as high quality as desktop ones.

Blizzard seeing its sales drop from subscribers on World of Warcraft III, are already in development of Diablo III for Android/iOS, which will be free to play minus the ads.

My point is, since you’re developing your games in Gdevelop, you’re not that far away from exporting them to Android/iOS. This will give you more exposure to the world.

Sorry, not telling you how to do your job or anything, but adding touchscreen actions to your game for mobile devices will open doors for you.

Then you will eventually get contacted by a big gaming company offering to buy out your company, which is common since the 90’s. Then you can sell your company and start another one and repeat again. :slight_smile:

I am an avid gamer too since the 2000’s; however, ever since mobile device games started getting better and better, it became more convenient to play on phones than to play on a desktop or laptop. Just my 2 cents.

I respect you and your comments as well. Cheering for your success.

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@ddabrahim

Correct yeah you’re right for sure, Miko is a simple game yeah.

I never said I’m “competing” when did I even say that? I make games that I love making not to compete with anyone, to be inspired has nothing to do with competing, that’s not me 100%

I’m not sure what you’re thinking but I won’t work on my next project for like 4 years and I hate working on it right? and again I haven’t even mentioned what is coming so again you can’t make assumption about something that doesn’t exist, it is something that I waited years to be ready for and work on.

I mean I can’t argue with that for sure, correct in that point.

I’d like it if you watch some documentaries about them first.
Also again I have no idea why you’re calling me arrogant? what that has to do with anything?

Again never said the game it self is a fail, just the marketing approach was that’s all, and I’m working on that and the post was made for that not to talk trash about my work, I see no one said anything wrong here, I have no idea why you’re just fighting like that?

Well I’m glad you found what you enjoy playing for sure, Miko is not for everyone, the games you enjoyed are not for everyone, I can’t make a game that’s for everyone.
If you don’t like Miko then that’s alright with me, I can’t force you to like a game, I mean no one can do that, I got many other people who did enjoy the game till the end, maybe you’re not just my audience that’s all and that’s not an issue even, there is nothing wrong with that.

Well I got many people who payed for the game and enjoyed playing yes, I’m not getting what is the issue here? Not having a demo is a choice I made and no one said it’s a bad choice or whatever, I believe this is something that only the developer of the game can decide and it’s not because I’m arrogant or whatever you’re saying, I’m sure when you release your game in the future you’d know why I did this and that, it’s a learning curve to know what works and what doesn’t, what hurts your game and what doesn’t, making a decision like that took years.

And I respect that man, no hard feelings, I’m not here to be loved by everyone, I’m just doing what I love, sharing my experience (even when I’m at the lowest point), learning from others and making friends along the way that’s all.

When you release a big game you worked on for years and years, you’d understand, and if you already did release one then I’m sure your experience is going to be different than mine and I hope you made/make the right choices when the right time comes.

I’m not arguing any further than that, you’re a friend and I’m sure friends don’t call each other arrogant.
Thank you dd :heart:

This the point I am trying to make here from a gamer point of view, want to or not, you do compete.
$10 is not something people spend on an impulse buy, most people consider where to spend this kind of money and Apple Arcade for $5 is the biggest competitor in this space because people more likely spend $5 just to try something than $10. So even if you sold Miko for $5 you still compete against the entire repository of Apple Arcade, want to or not.

I totally respect that, this is why I mentioned in the other topic that you removed after, it is the worst time to become a solo develop for profit. Just think about the fact many developers give up their games sold on Steam for $15 to Apple to make it available for $5 on iOS and macOS.

I watched many documentaries of successful indie developers who made 6 and 7 digit profit, while they do signal the right mindset to be motivated, committed, do your homework, do your research, they also talk bull*** when it comes to technical details and trying to hide the fact they paid people to get jobs done if not directly, they have purchased templates, tools, complete game source codes and used that.

I’m sorry maybe it was too hard, I’m only trying make it easier for you to accept the reality, if you want to make money, the gaming industry is the worst place currently and all those documentaries give you false hope.

I’m not saying to give up, but to do it because you love it, not for money, not because the market research shows people love to triple jump off roofs, and not even to make other people happy, do it to make your self happy and if you make money, consider it a bonus.

Good luck and stay away from depression :+1:

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@ddabrahim

Will do, thanks a lot dd : )